Weekly Question: Can the Israeli-Egyptian peace treaty survive the calls for change in Egypt?
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January 31, 2011
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Why might Al Jazeera have chosen The Guardian over larger Western news services to partner in the Palestine Papers leak?
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LUIS FROM MEXICO
5:42 pm
Feb 02, 2011
There are 1 million protesters; let’s concede there are 10 million………..Egypt has an 80 million population; the protesters are a loud savage crowd, but where are the 70 million of more educated egyptians???…….the silent majority is afraid and hiding!!!!
Some antisemites around the world are starting to blame Israel for the revolt in the muslim world; sooner or latter this was bound to happen.
Well-loved. Agree or Disagree:
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orbitar
10:37 pm
Feb 02, 2011
I agree that with the help of Heavens, incredible luck, very hard work and daring actions (as in the last 4000 years and particularly since 1947), Israel will overcome even that mortal danger if Muslim Brotherhood takes over Egypt. Large part of the population not only in Egypt but also in Western countries had been brainwashed to take anti-Jewish stand. Hundreds of millions dollars are being spent every year in anti-Israeli and anti-Jewish propaganda on campuses, schools, press, media, mosques and even in some missionary churches. It is mostly Saudi money supporting the Wahhabi agenda of projected SUNNI Worldwide Islamic Caliphate together with their adversaries in Iran. In spite of their domestic economic problems, Iran finances all the world terrorists to support their own dream of Mahdi returning to establish a SHIITE Worldwide Islamic Caliphate. There are 1400 million Muslims and many citizens have to pay the armed gangs money to support subversive terrorist causes. Jews worldwide are just 1% of that number – hardly 14 millions. On the top of it, there are “2 Jews and 3 opinions”. Less humorously said, there is no unity among Jews as many of them fall for demagogic arguments produced by such an overwhelming financially supported publicity machine. The last news (published in the West as well) claims that Mosad-trained sharks were sent to Sharam alSheikh to eat some tourists in order to harm Egyptian tourism. Most Muslims believe it and I am not so sure that all students or young people in the West (including some Jews) are laughing at it as at a bizarre joke. Number of Jews on this planet compared to anti-Semites is impossibly low. However smart, educated, inventive and capable, at a ratio of one Jew to 500 others on this planet seems to be a terrible disadvantage.
What I wanted to stress again is the fraudulent GAME, played by Iran, Wahhabists, Hamas, Muslim Brotherhood, Hezbollah, and Ahmadinejad personally, the anti-Semites, neo-Nazis, Holocaust deniers and other haters aiming at those few Jews scattered around the globe. It is sad that many of the powerful propaganda victims in the West believe that “voting means democracy”. Is it not clear, that voting of the brainwashed bandits will end up electing gangsters as their leaders? Look what happened in Iran and in Gaza, watch the present “elections” in Lebanon. To exchange secular Mubarak for an Iranian type ayatollah would be a bad mistake. It surely does not turn Mubarak into a saint but there might be such a thing as “lesser or larger evil”.
Throughout history, the SLAVE MASTERS (that time all rulers) hated Jews who were instigating their slaves to liberate themselves as the Jews did some 3300 years ago (coincidently from Egyptian slavery). Rulers trained even their own slaves to hate the liberated Jewish slaves who became Ibarus, Hebrews, Israelis, Judeans and Jews. The same process is going on now: Israeli Jews and their Arabs (20% of the population) are the only democracy in the area and guess, in the eyes of the Western students and many citizens, who the villain in the Middle East is. Is it the dictatorial Arab Islamic ruler or the democratically elected Israeli government? How many U.N.O. resolutions condemned any of the dictators or any terrorists? Almost none, while Israel is condemned almost daily. “Honest Reporting” is great in exposing it.
In spite of all this debate, let me come back to a conclusion, that this GAME is not about the Jews but about the aspirants trying to TAKE OVER THE WORLD and its WEALTH. It is not even about the “haves and have-nots”. Poor people do not make revolutions as they search for daily bread for their children and have no time for foolishness. Who starts wars are the aspirants for world domination as were in our generation Hitler and Stalin. This time they are the Muslims of both fighting denominations who aspire to take over. It took The West quite a few centuries to replace military expansions with business and correct the selfish errors of slavery by accepting Old Testament principles of equality and freedom for each individual. With this ideology, the countries became immensely successful and prosperous. People in the USA live on 40 000 dollars a year, while much of the Muslims in Egypt live on 2 dollars a day = 50 times less, Problem is also that their ruling class enjoys the same privileges as does the West, naturally paid by the USA. Via cell phones, TV and internet, the Tunisians, Egyptians and many other Islamic people learned about all those disproportions – and they want the same employment opportunities & income as the West enjoys. Unfortunately, they want it without the hard work and risk taking, without the pain to get proper education, without any TOLERANCE TO OTHER CULTURES AND RELIGIONS, without the tricky and unstable life so characteristic for democracies. The scared rulers cannot effort to give freedom to their citizens while the armed gangs roam the streets in large numbers guarding their clans in tribal societies So they are sending their people to kill the Jews who “train sharks against them”.
This conflict will not be solved until a new source of cheap energy would make that oil more expensive or even worthless. Only then the present Muslim dictators with presently unlimited financial resources will become working people again, who value rational thinking..
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Marek
1:10 pm
Feb 05, 2011
The Muslim Brotherhood and any other muslim organisation/political party are compelled by the Quran to kill all the infidels unless they “repent” and become muslim. Since the Israelis will not become muslims, the muslims will consider them arch enemies. As a result of this, if any muslim political party gets into power the peace treaty between Israel and Egypt will not survive. But all of this must happen because it is foretold by the Bible. Israel will be left alone and abandoned by all nations Israel will have no allies. But God is helping the Jews and will continue to help them. The Jews will not be defeated they will be victorious.
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ANGELO
1:20 pm
Feb 05, 2011
Marek…if you have to rely on GOD well, as a Roman catholic living in Italy let me tell you that the people of israel may end up defeated. Where was HE in the ’30s of last century. So Israel would better start to find out wether it’s intelligence operations are working properly and its army is following suitably the events. And if I may , in a humble way, give a suggestion to ll my Israeli friends….forget about Obama and start looking elsewhere. The man at the White House is no different than Chamberlain in 1938
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Yael Pedhatzur
6:44 pm
Feb 05, 2011
Angelo, you are sooooo right.I believe very srongly that God helps those who help themselves. And as far as Obama goes- you are so right yet agin. That man is a waste of everyones time. But 2012 is coming soon as is the end of his tenure.
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ANGELO
9:42 am
Feb 06, 2011
Yael, if , from the one hand, time passes at the speed of a lightning, from the other 2012 is still so far away.And start watching the events which could unfold on your eastern front. Which means that harsh times are ahead of us.. Is this a turnpike of History? Yes….Can we do something about it? Yes….But we should , ALL OF US , be willing to reverse the course of our existence. We must stop thinking that we, THE WESTENERS, are powerful, rich, and “accomplished”. And we must NEVER EVER forget that war ìs in the Human Genoma.
Now, in Europe Chancellor Merkel last October and Prime Minister Cameron , yesterday, have, FINALLY sank the MULTICULTURALISM. They have finally realized that European values coming from the ILLUMINIST REVOLUTION cannot live with the islamic extremism.
Better late than never…but….let’s not forget that 1939 came after 1929 which came after 1925 which started in 1920-1921 (the dates indicates recessions in the US)
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Barry Lubotta
2:22 am
Feb 06, 2011
Obama is less than just another Chamberlain. For those who feel Obama has lost Egypt, I say he won Egypt because events as they are unfoldin may be exactly what he has been hoping for. I have little doubt that Obama wants to see the Moslem Brotherhood taking power. Hell, if you read Aaron Kleins book “The Manchurian President”, you will learn that he has associated with the Brotherhood in America for years.
And given that the Brotherhood has already indicated it would put war with Israel at the top of its agenda, this too fits with Obamas desires, I believe. This is just a guess, but here is his opportunity to go down as the man who helped Muslims take over the entire mideast (not that I’m counting on it).
Personally, I’m through giving Obama even the slightest benefit of the doubt. I’ve studied the man, read plenty on him, and what we have here is an untrustworthy president with the power to do great harm to western interests. This is unprecedented and in modern history, a leader who does not have the best interests of the country he is ruling.
One of the people leading the US to have Mubarak leave is Bill Ayers, a true villain of the 20th century if there ever was one. Remember, Ayers and his wife went to Egypt last year hoping to have a contingent of 1000s cross into Gaza. Only 100 made it, but Ayers influence in this area is not to be underestimated.
As bad as Obama is, I don’t think we’ve seen the worst of him. Israel cannot trust him, American cannot trust him and yet his is the leader of the free world. This can only be explained as some sort of “aftershock” of 9/11. It just couldn’t have happened at any other time in Americas history. The bottom line? “The West has a sickness of the soul whereby its survival cannot be assured.” That’s a quote from someone else but it speaks for me as well.
Mr. Harper, on the other hand, is leaps and bounds ahead of Obama, a man of true integrity.
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Marek
1:59 pm
Feb 06, 2011
Angelo…. If all the world turned against Italy what chance would she have of surviving? I think nil !!! Yet the day after Israel became a nation just after WWII she was attacked by I believe it was 5 FIVE Arab nations with full armies. Israeli air-force consisted of 3 fighter airplanes I am not sure of the ground forces but very little because the British did not allow the Jews to obtain weapons before they became a nation, yet they where the ones who re-created Israel. All the other wars in between then and now have similar parallels eg. the Six Day War. If you have a spare moment Youtube “Israel Against All Odds” this is a documentary of some of the miracles that Israel experienced while fighting her wars. All I can say is GOD!!!. He will not and can not break a promise. As for the fact that Obama is a dodgy shonk that is obvious. It is clear by what he says and does that America, the People of America, and Peace in the Middle East is not his aim or goal. His interests are helping the Muslims. The sooner people open their eyes and do something the better. I mean Obama cant even produce a hospital report that he was born in the USA. As for Israel they must be very careful in what they say and do. By what I wrote before I did not mean that Israel should sit back and enjoy the show. They need to fight and fight hard and then when they are doing their utmost, then GOD will step in and help them like he has done every other time. As for the crisis in Egypt read Isaiah 19:1-4 I believe this is speaking about Egypt today. The Jews are GOD’s chosen people and that will never change. Since the devil is out to destroy the work of GOD he deceives the nations of the world into being anti-Semitic. Somebody in Germany recently wrote a book that the Jews have no right to the land they are on. The list goes on. Wait and watch and you will see.
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Gary Katz
7:34 am
Feb 07, 2011
Here’s the problem in a nutshell: Islam is the only religion with a military wing.
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LUIS FROM MEXICO
7:00 pm
Feb 08, 2011
For once in my life I am for a military regime in any country……..but I really hope the army takes over in Egypt after Mubarak leaves because it is the only real institution strong enough to put order in that place; and after a while, I am sure one general will “win” the elections and will rule the country with the same strong hand Mubarak did. This is the only hope Israel has to see the peace treaty survive this crisis.
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orbitar
5:28 pm
Feb 10, 2011
The Western world as well as Egypt Arab neighbors seems to realize that if they supported the “revolution” of the ‘seekers of democracy’ in the Cairo square, that it might mean the end of the world as we know it.
The precarious balance would collapse as a deck of cards. If Egypt is ruled by Muslim Brotherhood, (or anybody who would invite them to government of Egypt), the Suez Canal would be closed and/or used to blackmail the entire world. The Egyptian military arsenal (American modern weapons) will fall into the hands of the “revolutionaries” and even worse, because of domino effect, the Pakistani nuclear arsenal might INEVITABLY fall into the hands of Muslim Brotherhood. The entire Middle East oil including the Saudi, Kuwaiti, UAE, and Iraqi wells would follow. Through association with Hamas, the entire region would fall as a calculated action into hands of the Iranian government. The vicious ayatollahs, who few months ago have brutally suppressed a similar call for a little bit more democracy in their own country, would take over the region.
Facing this logical scenario, Sunni Saudis have reconsidered. Jordan too. Even the Muslim leaning USA president had a second thought. The West understood that the main source of energy from the Middle East might dry out in few hours. USA, Europe, Americas, China, India, and Japan would become blackmailed countries at the mercy of the ayatollahs or Hamas like militant rulers. The predominantly Christian West would have no choice but to speedily convert to Islam or perish – either strangled economically or subdued militarily.
Then would start the ultimate BLOODY WAR for which denomination – Sunnis or Shiites – would rule the WORLDWIDE ISLAMIC CALIPHATE. That battle alone might mean the end of the world, as we know it, because both sides would fight to death not having even a slightest consideration for millions of potential victims.
All we can do is to prevent this scenario from happening. If we fail, our children and grandchildren will grow up under the Sharia Law.
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Gary Katz
9:03 pm
Feb 10, 2011
Orbitar, don’t forget that the oil exporting Arabs need us as much as we need their oil, maybe more. Most of those countries have virtually no economy other than oil. We would suffer if the oil spigots were turned off, but at least we can get oil from places like Mexico, Canada, Texas and Alaska. Where would they get money and food? It could give “sandwiches” a whole new meaning. Don’t get me wrong – I’m also worried about the “Muslim Brother Hoods (I just made that up)” taking over; I’m merely stating it’s a lot more complicated of an equation than you might make it out to be.
To tell the truth, I believe the main threat to Israel is from a smuggled nuke, where all the sneaky terrorists deny responsibility, thinking Israel can’t retaliate if Israel can’t prove who supplied it. The second top threat to Israel would be a coordinated attack from Hezbollah, Gaza and Syria. The Muslim Brotherhood probably wouldn’t be able to talk enough Egyptians (much less the Egyptian military) into a direct assault on Israel, but they could loosen restrictions on their border with Gaza, to increase Hamas’ military capability. Such a scenario would turn very bloody for all sides.
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orbitar
5:21 am
Feb 11, 2011
Gary, this is exactly what I am trying to say. In recent weeks, the rich Arab countries and governments are closer to Israel than they are to their “brothers” ready to murder and rob them. Iran is supporting Hamas, Hamas is a close friend to Muslim Brother Hoods (I like your invented name) and Brother Hoods are very much sympathizing with Al Qaida, trying not only harm but mortally wound the Western interest and expel the Westerners from the Arab lands (so they can rule them themselves). The masses are apathetic and lethargic. Poor people do not make revolutions, rich ones do. Poor and naïve people shout a little or are sent to blow up themselves together with few enemy civilians, or to get some virgins and booze forbidden to them here and now become available in their promised heaven. In dictatorships, naïve and poor people ‘demanding democracy’ have no voice or influence. Without exception, in Middle eastern Muslim lands are all ruled by dictators, regardless if they call themselves presidents, kings, leaders or ayatollahs. Muslims have a traditional saying, “ENEMY OF MY ENEMY IS MY FRIEND AND FRIEND OF MY ENEMY IS MY ENEMY”. They all have to ‘openly curse Israel ‘, but secretly they even cooperate with Israelis against their REAL temporary enemies among the other Muslim rulers, countries, governments, and movements.
On the other hand, Islam does not tolerate “infidels” among them and wherever a Muslim once lived, it becomes ”Muslim land”. As written in Quran, their target is to take over the entire planet. So to trust any of them is extremely dangerous but to cooperate here and there is very practical and useful. Islam is not a religion as the West sees religions. Islam is a political & military movement designed to take over the world BY FORCE. Deceit in Quran s not only allowed, but also recommended as a weapon. Their trick is to fool the naïve enemies into complacency and then stab them in the back in the middle of the night. This is how Mohamed got into power and his first money to start recruiting more soldiers for his gang that became his army. Whoever is interested to find it in writing can do what I did – read Quran. It is there word by word the same way as intentions of Hitler can be read in MEIN KAMPF. Originally, I believed that the Quran translation was inaccurate and bias and I bought another translation. However, any edition or translation has shown the same ‘treachery as a method ‘and ‘murder as a virtue’. A religious Muslim (most are) are 100% Muslims and believers. They have a death penalty for deviation from their faith. Both converts from Islam and Infidels deserve death penalty. In comparison, most Christians never read their Bible and even if they did, they do not go as far as to enforce it by violence. Compared to Muslims, they are religious to an average of 10 – 20%.
When it comes to MILITARY confrontations with the armed Muslim enemies, there is no other way but either destroy them or harm them sufficiently so that they would stop attacking Israel at least for a while = until their next attempts or attacks. In this debate, I am not going to work out either tactics or strategy for the Israeli army. It might be an interesting debate, but not very fruitful. I know that plenty of nice people (“bleeding hearts” who hate violence) have a wonderful suggestion: “When you are nice to them they would be nice to you”. No, they would not become nice, as the contrary is true. This method leads to a suicide of those who believe it. Did this method work during the Holocaust? NO, IT DID NOT!! Is program of the radical and not so radical Muslims IDENTICAL TO NAZI DOCTRINE? Yes, IT IS. If we do not want to allow the next Holocaust to happen, we have no choice but to drop all illusions and niceties and defend ourselves by both smartness and force, as we had to do since 1947; wave after wave, war after war, attach after attack. It applies to both Israel and the Jews in general. Only those Jews who resisted and fought the Nazis made it alive. The same applies to Israelis. Remember, that the Nazis were defeated militarily by their rivals for world supremacy and not because they were punished for their crimes against humanity or for committing genocide against the Jewish people. To the contrary – the “civilized world” watched either with indifference or with a mean smile as we were bleeding. The situation we are in NOW (and will remain into the foreseeable future) is identical.
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Nelson D'Silva
1:30 am
Sep 06, 2011
Not a chance if the Muslim Brotherhood takes over. Israel must be prepared to face turbulent times because it is inevitable that the peace treaty will be rendered null and void by any new Egyptian regime.
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