Israel Responds to Guardian Child Abuse Charge
February 2, 2012 14:39 by Simon Plosker
The Guardian saw fit to publish eight letters in response to accusations of Israeli mistreatment of Palestinian child detainees. Only one of those (January’s Letter of the Month) sided with Israel. The Guardian has, however, given the press attache for the Israeli Embassy in London, Amir Ofek, the opportunity to respond, which we republish in full here:
Your special report looks at allegations that Israel’s military justice system mistreats Palestinian children who have been arrested for throwing stones.
“Many are exhausted from sleep deprivation. Day after day they are fettered to the chair, then returned to solitary confinement. In the end, many sign confessions that they later say were coerced,” you state. But you omit the horrific nature of the atrocities that minors, some as young as 12, can be arrested for.
Hakim Awad, 17, is a minor. Last March he and his 18-year-old cousin, Amjad, brutally murdered the Fogel family while they slept. No mercy was shown to three-month-old Hadas, her two brothers (aged four and 11) and their parents. The scene of the crime, including the severed head of a toddler, left even the most experienced of police officers devastated. The duo proudly confessed to their killings, and they have shown no subsequent remorse.
Between 2000-04, 292 minors took part in terrorist activities. Shocking images of Palestinian infants dressed in explosive vests are only the tip of the hate industry that Palestinian children are exposed to. Ismail Tsabaj, 12, Azi Mostafa, 13, and Yousuf Basam, 14, were sent by Hamas on a mission chillingly similar to the one involving the Fogels, aiming to penetrate a Jewish home at night and slaughter a family in their beds. In this case, the IDF fortunately stopped them in time.
Ian S. Lovestock
6:03 pm
Feb 02, 2012
British anti-Israel comments are as a result of being guilted by their decision to abandon pre-state Palestine and not be complicent any more than they were in helping the Arabs armies finish off Hilter’s goal.
It makes me wonder how HM army and police would react toward Irish kids tossing deadly missiles, including rocks, at them?
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cba
6:18 pm
Feb 02, 2012
As the infamous quote goes, “Don’t change the subject, we’re talking about Jews.” Er, I mean, Zionists… The fact that Israel behaves better than ANY other country in the world, in the face of much tougher challenges, is irrelevant to the Israel-haters.
Plus ca change, plus c’est la meme chose (no accents on my computer, sorry).
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Abdul-Hurriyah
6:36 pm
Feb 02, 2012
The BBC should spend more time on the issue of cultural-child-abuse by those muslims who follow Hamas and teach kids as young as 3 to hate Jews, to embrace martyrdom in the name of Allah, and even dress them up as suicide-bombers.
Hamas run a Tv station which reveals an astonishing mediatic agenda when it comes to children-orient tv programs — as Memri and PMW have repeatedely shown us.
So, the BBC seems to find OK a religious movement that invests in children hate-propaganda as a cultural device to “beat into shape” the coming generations — something worth of Goebbel’s dreams and agenda — yet it’s ready to accuse the whole Israeli government for what might be an isolated accident in a harsh context which I believe Amir Ofek has well explained.
Of course, British-bound BBC should find it easier to turn away their cameras from the atrocities — past and present — carried out by British imperialism.
Anyhow, if the Arabs in Eretz Israel don’t like the conditions of life there, they could back to Jordan since that is were they came from when they migrated to occupy the Jewish Land.
And let’s stop calling them «Palestinians». There were no Palestinian people amongst the Arab nations. The word was stolen from the ancient Philistei (which were not Arabs!) when they had to justify their presence in the Holy Land.
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Joseph
11:16 pm
Feb 10, 2012
Abdul, you have hot the nail on the head. What is behind all this hatred is the fact that the Chrisitan dogma cannot accept the Jew as part of the present. Yes, some seem to have survived in spite of the new religion that began about eighteen centuries ago, and some seem to have survived the physical destruction of so many at the hands of those who espoused the new religion. Nevertheless, the European Christian mindset cannot grasp and fully accept the notion of present day Jewish sovereignty. It is not a question of location, but of Jewish national survival itself.
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Paul Tenenbaum
9:56 pm
Feb 02, 2012
Some years back there were some Englishmen who had compassion and understanding. Such appears no longer to be the case with the British Media. Is it $$$$ ?
Why is it that there has been and is a latent “dislike” for Jews in the UK which goes back centuries, yes even to the 12th century. So, I can guess ONLY that through religion there is that “transmission” to the next generation.
Instilling hatred into the minds of young children is nothing new. With technology available there is so much more damage done. I wish that ALL clergy would stay out of politics – and that goes for Iran as well- and leave the rest of the population “grow up” with decency and respect.
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Bill Kelly
12:46 am
Feb 03, 2012
It is so very sad that these children are taught such hate for Israel. We should pray for them, and support efforts to fight against the propaganda that poisons them. As Honest Reporting is doing also.
Consider that if they believe in murdering, and at that, little children, of their “enemies’, that lying to make Israel look bad, and to justify themselves, is not any kind of stretch of their reasoning. The terrorist Islamists seem to believe ant any means justifies their end of destroying Israel, and all of God’s people, by any method, including lying. What they may not be completely aware of , is that they are already doing anything they can to justify a false, and evil hatred for Jews and Christians. Or anyone, even among their own, who gets in the way of their hateful, and vengeful false god, Allah, and his supposed agenda to convert or kill all people to his religion of bondage and hatred.
What we can do, each of us, to change this, as much as we can, is to be different. Israel was taught to love the strangers in her gates. And she is trying to maintain this standard. It is my hope that all the world, including our fathers in the Christian faith, which is Israel, will learn the love, and grace that our messiah Yeshua taught us, that is, fulfilling the teaching of the Torah and the Prophets, that we should love and pray for those who persecute us, and despite fully use us.
We pray for God’s blessing and guidance on Israel, and all her leaders. These are tough and perilous times for many. And how sad and difficult it must also be for those born into Islamic Palestinian families, and taught to hate the nation that God chose to bless them, and the rest of the world.
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Brent Pudsey
3:04 pm
Feb 04, 2012
Israel has responded to international criticism in a way which shows tolerance and respect. Their media has chosen not to name call or be critical of the media. In this way I applaud the efforts of Israel in being peaceful and diplomatic in their dealing with the world stage. The British media and other media outlets around the globe need to understand that children being used as pawns in warfare need to be treated as other solidiers would be treated. Thus Israel must act or face the loss of life. Israel does act and has acted in a way that is tactful and humanitarian.
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Celato
9:10 pm
Feb 05, 2012
Amir Ofek’s article sums up perfectly why complaints about media coverage of Israel so often fall on deaf ears.
Instead of producing EVIDENCE to refute the Guardian’s allegations, Ofek devotes acres of space to cataloguing widely disparate crimes committed by juveniles. When he finally (and very briefly) addresses the precise matter at hand – that children claim to have been maltreated in Israeli prisons – all he offers by way of “rebuttal” is that such treatment is not permitted by law and therefore can’t be happening …(!)
This man is the press attache of the Israeli Embassy in London. Surely it cannot have been beyond his wit and powers to check out exactly what procedures were followed in the detention of the two juveniles featured in the Guardian video and then respond to their allegations head-on. His failure to do so does nothing to improve Israel’s image. All he achieves is a further fuelling of perceptions that Israelis are “in denial” about police/military wrongdoings – either that, or couldn’t give a damn.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Raanana Gamer
2:41 pm
Feb 06, 2012
I agree with Celato. It’s not good enough, and that’s being polite. If I were in a responsible position at the Embassy, I would not be happy at the line taken. The question then becomes: why was this line taken? Who decided on what strategy to take. I hope there’s some serious introspection going on inside the Embassy. (I have my doubts, however.)
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Reece
2:29 am
Feb 08, 2012
For some reason this is not letting me share on my facebook says the link is not working
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Gerald
6:00 am
Feb 14, 2012
Celete and Raanana, if the Brirish press were half as energetic in investigating the atrocities of the British forces in Iraq and Afghaninstan one could take their protestation against Israel with less derision and contempt. A study of the blood soaked treacherous history of Great? Britian would leave any open-minded student with a sense of utter revulsion. Ask any true Scot, Welshman, Irishman or any of the miilions which make up the so-called British Commonwealth who have done such a study of British treachery and atrocities in their lands, and some vestige of the truth about Britian may filter through the fog of ignorance that Englishmen wallow in, so it’s no great surprise that their press is so distorted, and as we are now finding out, will stoop to the lowest possible to get a story. A manipulative Monarchy which is rotten to the core, and one which the rest of the western world about to suffer the results of. Add the City of Londons criminal financial dealings. What a legacy! And these charlatans preach democracy when they know not that which they have the bare-faced temerity to preach to others.Hypocrites All.
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Raanana Gamer
7:08 am
Feb 14, 2012
Gerald:
“…if the Brirish press were half as energetic in investigating the atrocities of the British forces in Iraq and Afghaninstan one could take their protestation against Israel with less derision and contempt.”
I understand where you are coming from, but two wrongs do not make a right.
“A study of the blood soaked treacherous history of Great? Britian would leave any open-minded student with a sense of utter revulsion. Ask any true Scot, Welshman, Irishman or any of the miilions which make up the so-called British Commonwealth who have done such a study of British treachery and atrocities in their lands, and some vestige of the truth about Britian may filter through the fog of ignorance that Englishmen wallow in, so it’s no great surprise that their press is so distorted, and as we are now finding out, will stoop to the lowest possible to get a story.”
True Scot? I can tick that box. And I can also ensure you that my education – formal and informal – amply covered the good, bad and the ugly aspects of the British Empire. But, again, two wrongs do not make a right.
“A manipulative Monarchy which is rotten to the core, and one which the rest of the western world about to suffer the results of.”
Sorry, I do not get that.
“Add the City of Londons criminal financial dealings. What a legacy! And these charlatans preach democracy when they know not that which they have the bare-faced temerity to preach to others.Hypocrites All.”
We can agree the world is full of hypocrites. But it’s also hypocritical to claim – RIGHTLY – Western values of democracy and civil rights, but reject criticism by deflection. The points should have been dealt with. We should have nothing to be afraid of or ashamed of. And if we, heaven forbid, do, we need to sort it out.
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Gerald
12:39 am
Feb 15, 2012
Raanana, Two wrongs don’t make a right??? How many wrongs does the state of Israel have to endure before the world calls a halt to the savagry she has had to put up with since the treachery of British in 1917? What other country has made so many efforts to appease her avowed enemies, which also surround her and continue to make their desire to wipe Israel off the map, and are aided by one-sided reporting by western media? This tiny little country has had to fight four wars of survival since 1948, against massively larger and better armed belligerent neighbours, and won each time. How many Jews are attended to in Arab hospitals? Does Hamas warn Israel of their rocket attacks, as Israel IDF warned Gazans to vacate areas Hamas was using as rocket firing bases before IDF responded militarily? Some of those were homes and some were directly outside schools. Did the IDF use ambulances as transport vehicles? There is no other country in the world which has suffered from the biased press than Israel, and the English media have been some of the worse. Truly two wrongs cannot make a right, but when one is continually villified by biased and lying media, it makes the job of rightousness that much harder to attain. Have you ever written to the Guardian or BBC or any other media in regards to the way they report matters pertaining to Israel and the Middle East in general? Perhaps when Britian gets heaved out of Europe, which I assure you is going to happen, she may then have a small inkling of what Israel has endured for so long. Her historical enemy, Germany, has risen to a pre-eminent place both politically and industrialy and now financially, and will ensure the demise of England as a European power. And debt-stricken USA will be of little help. A morally and ethicly bankrupt nation will soon have more problems than she can handle, and from a position of isolation may appreciate the vissitudes of Israel.
I accept you are a pretty reasonable person Raanana, and I get the feeling you know of the excesses of the British media, so understand my comments in no way are directed at you personally, I just detest the continual screed of lies and dis-information about Israel. Of course a corporate owned media is the last place to look for the truth so the struggle unfortunately will be ongoing. Shalom.
The comments made re the British monarchy and City of London are germain as this is where the rot radiates from. As you claim some level of studentship, I suggest you dig a wee bit deeper about those two entities, the results may well shock you.
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Raanana Gamer
6:15 pm
Feb 15, 2012
“There is no other country in the world which has suffered from the biased press than Israel, and the English media have been some of the worse.”
Agreed.
“Have you ever written to the Guardian or BBC or any other media in regards to the way they report matters pertaining to Israel and the Middle East in general?”
Yes.
“I accept you are a pretty reasonable person Raanana, and I get the feeling you know of the excesses of the British media, so understand my comments in no way are directed at you personally,”
I never thought otherwise.
“I just detest the continual screed of lies and dis-information about Israel.”
So do I.
“Of course a corporate owned media is the last place to look for the truth so the struggle unfortunately will be ongoing.”
Agreed.
“The comments made re the British monarchy and City of London are germain as this is where the rot radiates from. As you claim some level of studentship, I suggest you dig a wee bit deeper about those two entities, the results may well shock you.”
There is something rotten at the heart of Britain.
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Celato
9:29 pm
Feb 16, 2012
Gerald:
The point I was trying to make was that a major reason for the bad press Israel gets is the generally appalling quality of its own PR in responding to inaccurate and/or unfair reporting.
Let’s consider as an example your correspondence with Raanana …
The observations you make about Britain’s conduct, Hamas rockets, etc, may be largely valid and might even have some relevance in providing background context; but they entirely ignore the foreground. By ducking the specific issue at hand – that Israel stands accused in a Guardian story of mistreating juveniles in custody – you leave me completely in the dark about which of the following (or other?) positions you take in condemning this particular report:
1. The story is entirely false – Israeli police NEVER treat children in the manner alleged and the two juveniles featured in the story must therefore be telling lies.
2. There may be some truth in what these two are claiming, but if so their experience would have been the result of an aberration by officers behaving wrongly.
3. It doesn’t matter a jot if the story is true. If those juveniles were given the rough ride they describe, it must have been for a very good reason.
Without knowing your stance on these, how can I possibly tell if you are (a) demanding a correction; (b) accusing the Guardian of exaggeration and demanding a balancing “right of reply” via an article detailing Israel’s fine track-record on investigating and punishing cases of child abuse in prisons; or (c) wanting the Guardian to carry a story of equal prominence explaining why certain juveniles in the Israeli context are justifiably interviewed without an adult present, held in solitary confinement, shackled to their chairs, etc.
All I can tell from the way things stand is that you view pretty well EVERY story which criticizes Israel as unfair and/or hypocritical. The constant message you send to the world’s media is: “Either report sympathetically about Israel and focus on the good deeds Israel does, or keep your damn noses out and hypocritical traps shut!”
Hardly a recipe for making friends and influencing editors, is it…?
Now look again at Amir Ofek’s response to the Guardian article. Unlike you (I presume), he is a professional in the PR field; yet he too treats the child abuse issue as something that hardly matters at all. If this accurately reflects Israel’s “official” attitude, then there really is no hope of defusing the moral outrage of a great many people to whom the issue matters a lot.
If, however, Israel DOES take allegations of abuse seriously and wants the world to know it, Mr Ofek should immediately be sent on a re-training course.
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Gerald
1:28 pm
Feb 19, 2012
Celato, One could be forgiven for suspecting that you hadn’t read what I have written, but it is obvious you fail miserably to understand the intent. I will try to answer your questions and hopefully assist you to understand my meaning.
1 “The story is entirely false” yes I believe it was entirely and michieviously false. I also note that the Guardian (BTW what is this rag the guardian of? It certainly is not the TRUTH ) gave little or no mention of the rebuttal of the story by the Israel Security Agency, who would have had jurisdiction in this case. That you then go on to miscontrue my conclusion by adding that it must be that I believe that IDF never mistreat those they arrestted for whatever cause, they probably do. No military group is without sin in this area, and many there are who can arrest of the sometime barbarity of the English military. Israel however is in the most invidious position ever encountered by any nation, being surrounded by enemies who openly vow to exterminate them. The Guardian and most of the British media have an historical record of blatant anti Israei-ism. The BBC ranks among among the worse. There are many agencies in Israel who have oversight of how detainees are treated, a feature not replicated by her enemies.
2. What objective standard did the writer of the story, Harriet Sherwood?, apply to what these young detainees have to tell. Did she actually interview them in an Israeli prison or had they been released? The description of the conditions they were held in, did she actually see these? Or perhaps this is again in a long line of Arab propaganda. Being detained by the IDF would not have engendered anything but hostility from these two, and given the propensity for Arab youth to commit all kinds of atrocities, their tales would/should be highly suspect. I personally would give little credence to them without corrobarating evidence. Was there any? Don’t think so.
3 As I give the Guardian no credibility at all for this story this does not apply
The sarcasm fairly dribbling from your foggy ignorance here. I don’t expect anything honourable from the British media at all, as they have proven themselves on countless ocassions to be utterly devoid of honest reporting when it come to matters involving Israel. And from reports of the ongoing enquiry of the British media, and their Police, corruption is the standard that these days which applies. You say you can’t tell what my stance is, Even the meanest intelligence would have had no trouble in deciding that I was disgusted with the British medias continual bias in regards to Israel. Would that they were able to compare the butchery applied to their own nationals by Middle East dictators and the way Israel treatsd it’s protestors, and reach any other conclusion other than Israel treats it’s own with far more respect and decency. That you go on repeating the claims made by the Arabs indicates that you also are just as biased as the others so condemned. And your next paragraph is absolute proof of my contention. Am I CONSTANTLY sending messages to the world’s media. I ocassionally do when I detect what I believe to be distortions and /or blatant lies, and there is a CONSTANT flow of those in the world media.
My purpose is not to make friends but to expose the rampant media bias against Israel. Having read Amir Ofek’s response I don’t feel he has any cause to seek any PR re-training, he stated the position of the Govt. of Israel succinctly and like me waits for some semblance of balance from the Guardian, but like me he will wait a blood long time for that.
Moral outrage???? From a country steeped in it’s own history of outrageous behaviour, it’s laughable that you should be outraged by any actions of others. And as I said in my earlier to Naarana, that the Irish,Welsh and Scots can attest to the atrocities visited upon them by the British, and how did the media record those??
As the ISA stated they do take such allegations seriously and do investigate same. But when the said allegations have no bases in fact the is nothing to investigate. I am not surprised you accept the words of the Arab miscreants, your own distorted view of Israel almost demands it.
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Jan Z Freed
8:00 pm
Mar 18, 2012
Even if the stories of mistreatment of the youths are true, it would be wrong to ignore bias in the Guardian if such is the case. And bias, not treatment of youths in detention, is pretty much the main topic here. Does the Guardian, or its readers, really give a rat’s a__ that some little thugs are having a hard time? Probably not.
I would bet big time that any analysis of the Guardian (for one paper) would show bias. And, I am not a gambler. For example, how many articles in the Guardian in the last year simply describe Arab rocket attacks, or other terrorist activities (that is without apologist commentary?) I leave it to the defenders of the Guardian’s honor to supply us with lots of examples, in comparison with negative articles about Israel.
I think many British just don’t like Jews. Duh! And, so it comes out here and there.
I think it really bugs them that the Jews consider themselves
“chosen”. So, we have a society seething with sibling rivalry. Still, they should be shown for what they are: jealous children.
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nafg
10:23 am
Mar 19, 2012
Re the idea that antisemitism is jealousy of the fact that Jews consider themselves chosen:
(a) So do many other societies, such as Christians and Muslims. America used to believe in Manifest Destiny. The list goes on.
(b) Chosen-ness is nothing to be jealous of. It doesn’t mean we are entitled to privileges, but that we have extra responsibilities (although there are privileges as a result but that’s between us and G-d, it’s not something we demand of others). Besides the government is secular so I don’t know what kind of chosen-ness they believe in. (Of course many don’t realize this, so the main thing is (a).)
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